Need a traanny nose piece.

[toutsuu]

Well my car is in the shop and apparently the nose peice on the tranny is not replacable, you have to replace the whole front peiece of the transmission which is a 600 part new and can't be found used or they said they found a tranny with 40k miles on it for 950 that I could swap out for instead.

Does this sound right? Anywhere I can find a cheap rebuilt tranny?

[sbiggi]

You need to go to Jack(IAT)

He is down off Garden of the Gods (or whatever it turns into if you go East) and Nevada in ColoSprings.

-Seth

[Hal]

If "nose piece" means bell housing, yes they are correct.

The front case and bell housing are one piece.

What model year is the car?

Hal

[Mirage]

I have several 1g trannies (10!) usable for parts only. Get the model year and I'll see if I have a usable bellhousing I can grab.

Also, AWD and FWD?

Marcus

[toutsuu]

91 Eagel Talon AWD Turbo. I know I should have gone to Jack's but I just had it towed to JJ's in monument because it was close and they were open on Saturday. They already pulled the whole transmission to do the clutch and discovered the clutch fork was broken and the bell housing looked bad.

I looked at used and rebuilt trannies and the 950 price they gave me looks about right on the dot as far as what I am seeing for prices of rebuilds and used trannies. Of course the rebuilds don't include new bell housings, and the used trannies don't include new seals and such. The tranny they have only has 40k miles on it so it doesn't seem like a bad deal when a new one is around 3,000.

[fusionsport]

What is wrong with your bellhousing exactly? it is really hard to screw one of these up unless the 12mm bolt in the back wasnt put in.
I also find it VERY hard to believe the clutch fork broke- it is a really heavy cast iron piece.

Go get the pieces of your transmission, all of them, tell the tranny shop you are having it rebuilt and will bring it back to them for install. Take the pieces to Jack and let him rebuild it for you. For 900 bucks you can have a nice rebuilt trans and the peace of mind knowing your transmission was done right.

[Hal]

Actually, oem 1g clutch fork breakage is a fairly thing.

The 2g fork is a bit heavier and there *was* a forged unit available for a while from an aftermarket supplier.

Hal

[Bryan Savage]

It is really hard to screw one of these [bellhousing] up unless the 12mm bolt in the back wasnt put in. Back when I used to work for a dealer, I bought a new '94 transmission and put it in my talon along with an ACT 2600. I stopped at a store to visit a friend a couple days later. When I was in the parking spot, I thought the car was in neutral, but it was in first. I popped the clutch before shutting the car off and the bellhousing split longitudinally (in line with the car) two inches and folded over itself an eighth of an inch. The flywheel cover collapsed on itself and belt inward and put a nice groove in the back of my new flywheel. I was able to reach down and bend it out of the way by hand so it would stop scraping while the car was running.

Since I did the work and I know what I'm doing, the parts manager let me warranty the whole thing and I got a new one for nothing. Nobody in the shop had ever seen anything like it.

[fusionsport]

holy crap!

[toutsuu]

I guess the bellhousing is pretty warn and caused the clutch fork to break? According to the shop... they said that they could build the worn peice back up at the tranny shop but it wouldn't last as long, wouldn't be worth it because they can't guarantee it. I haven't bought the used 40k tranny yet just told them i want to look at it, apparently the bellhousing is part of the whole front piece and has to be replaced entirely and a new one is 600 so the used tranny might be worth it.

[fusionsport]

get the pieces and take the tranny to Jack- seriously you will not regret it

[toutsuu]

It's too late, I should not have told them to do anything, but I thought all I needed was a clutch so the car is already apart meaning it's not going to cost me anymore to have them put in the new used tranny, I just have to pay for the part.

[Hal]

I don't understand how the bell housing can wear and cause the clutch fork to break.

Hal

[mac214]

I will second taking the tranny to Jack and having him build it.

Then, like fusionsport said, you can just pick it up and have the mechanic re-install the tranny.

While you are in there, have Jack do some of the upgrades, especially if they are charging $900 for the Tranny. I have seen some used one go for around $400, but I am not sure on the mileage. Even with 40k on the tranny they are quoting, you will still have the weak links of the DSM tranny.

[darkturbo]

is it fwd or awd?? I have a fwd trans you can have for 200 bucks for the whole trans

[toutsuu]

It's AWD... do you have Jack's address or phone number?

[mac214]

Phone number is 719-243-5305.

I usually don't leave messages on his phone. If he doesn't answer the first time, I call back because his phone only rings 3 times and then goes to voicemail. If he doesn't answer, then I just give it some time and call back later. (This is what he suggested doing to get ahold of him)

He is a great guy and will spend the time to go over the options with you for your tranny.

[toutsuu]

Ok so here is what happened and I am gonna call Jack and get my car to him so he can look at it.

They put used tranny in, rear wheels were locking up?

They tried another tranny, seemed better at first, now problem is worse, just dragging the rear end.

That's also why I missed the Meet.

[Hal]

Broken center diff or transfer case.

[toutsuu]

Well it wasn't broken when I brought it in... so what caused it? Bad tranny from junk yard?

[DlandryTSI]

How long did it take before the rear tires locked up? If it took some time then more than likely whoever did the work didn't put any gear oil in the transfer case which would cause it to lock up.

--Dave

[fusionsport]

How long did it take before the rear tires locked up? If it took some time then more than likely whoever did the work didn't put any gear oil in the transfer case which would cause it to lock up.

--Dave


effin word- many times when people dont know any better they assume the t-case is sealed or no fluid leaked out, etc. I know of a couple of people who have had thier new t-cases installed under warranty have them seize up because the dealer tech assumed it was factory filled and/or sealed and neglected to put lube in it.

[Bryan Savage]

Here's a dumb question... is the parking brake on?

[toutsuu]

Ya.... it took a couple hours.

[eclipse92gsx]

I'm betting on the t-case bearings are welded now

[toutsuu]

Jack said they might havwe "forgot" to put fluid in the T case, they are so sued.

[DlandryTSI]

Jack said they might havwe "forgot" to put fluid in the T case, they are so sued.

Didn't I say that at the end of page 2?

Anyways. You'll be lucky if nothing else was messed up. Such as the rear diff and the center diff.

--Dave

[Jack(IAT)]

It's also possible that the trannies they popped in there were those 30k Japan units that will sometimes have the wrong FW gear ratio. After a few miles the center diff will break.

I have also seen people replace their rear diffs with units out of an automatic, or swap gears out from another diff with the wrong ratio that will also kill the center diff, or do damage to the t-case if it is already not in good shape.

Having said that though, I have never seen a blown center diff lock up the rear wheels. I would say something happened to the t-case or rear end to do that. I have noticed on t-cases that break with no fluid, the bearings will try to push their way out of the case. If you look under the car, you might see a big hole on the side of the t-case...

Jack

[Jack(IAT)]

Back when I used to work for a dealer, I bought a new '94 transmission and put it in my talon along with an ACT 2600. I stopped at a store to visit a friend a couple days later. When I was in the parking spot, I thought the car was in neutral, but it was in first. I popped the clutch before shutting the car off and the bellhousing split longitudinally (in line with the car) two inches and folded over itself an eighth of an inch. The flywheel cover collapsed on itself and belt inward and put a nice groove in the back of my new flywheel. I was able to reach down and bend it out of the way by hand so it would stop scraping while the car was running.

Since I did the work and I know what I'm doing, the parts manager let me warranty the whole thing and I got a new one for nothing. Nobody in the shop had ever seen anything like it.

That is actually common when the rear 12MM head bolt is missing or loose, or the dowel pins are missing between the block and bell housing. When the car is launched hard, the tranny will shift and the bell housing will break. On 6-bolts, the block is so weak at each end that sometimes when that happens it will break the block as well. Also, sometimes people will fully torque down the 2 top 14MM head bolts tight when the tranny isn't fully flush and crack the housing in that area. I can repair that, believe it or not. I have a special solution I make in my industrial spin-jet heated parts washer to clean the housing enough to weld it perfectly. I have yet to have any of my welds come undone on any bell housing. I had one where 1/4 of the housing was broken clean off. After welding it, it is still on the road to this day. I have gotten very good and TIG welding Mitsus horrible aluminum housings. If you can get your old tranny back, grab it. I can fix it to make it worth something, or I might be willing to buy it as it is.

On another note... If you have a 1G tranny with a worn aluminum TOB sleeve, I can also machine those to fit the 2G replaceable steel sleeve.

Jack

[TSi21]

I have seen a center diff break to the point that the rear wheels lock up. When someone tried to tow my car they stupidly put it up on a dolly. This caused the center diff to pretty much weld itself together into a huge mess. They dragged the car for a while after the wheels locked up and I'm sure that didn't help. So it is possible that the center diff welded itself due to a lack of lubrication.

Chris

[Jack(IAT)]

I have seen a center diff break to the point that the rear wheels lock up. When someone tried to tow my car they stupidly put it up on a dolly. This caused the center diff to pretty much weld itself together into a huge mess. They dragged the car for a while after the wheels locked up and I'm sure that didn't help. So it is possible that the center diff welded itself due to a lack of lubrication.

Chris

Yep, but if you start the engine and try to drive it the diff 'should' act like a welded unit when the upper gear welds itself to the center diff case like that. The rear wheels locked up, because the front wheels were not moving when strapped to the truck. If you were driving the car when the diff failed, you probably wouldn't notice it until you try to turn in a tight spot. I make dual torrington 4 spiders now the prevent both the upper and lower gears from breaking their thrust washers. The VC unit will burn up before the gears break with the torringtons.

Jack

[Bryan Savage]

If you can get your old tranny back, grab it. I can fix it to make it worth something, or I might be willing to buy it as it is.
Jack That's awful sweet of you Jack :), but that was years ago. With a warranty item that expensive, DCX wanted it back. I'm sure it's in a heap somewhere collecting dust at the warranty HQ.

I never use bolts to suck transmissions on. I've seen too many idiots screw stuff up pretty badly that way. Though usually when I finish working on my car, I've got a handful of bolts left over :D, I always make sure none of the aforementioned bolts go to the bell housing. Now I make sure to eeeeeease up on the clutch in any vehicle whilst parking.

[Jack(IAT)]

For those that are curious... We got the car in today and found it has one of those JDM trannies in it with the wrong FW gear ratio. For every 4 turns of the rear wheels, the fronts turn 5. Because of this, the center diff upper gear killed the thrust washer and welded itself to the housing. The center diff is now like a welded unit. Before the center diff had to fight the front and rear wheels, but now that it gave up, the tires themselves are screeching trying to fight each other down the road. The rear tires didn't lock up they just make a lot of noise because they are the only thing left to give...

Jack

[turbotalon007]

I make dual torrington 4 spiders now the prevent both the upper and lower gears from breaking their thrust washers.
Jack

How much for the 4 spider and instal?

[Jack(IAT)]

A single torrington unit is $375 and the new dual torrington is $475. Install depends on what else needs to be done. If you want the diff and that's it, I can replace that with the tranny in the car for 2 hours worth of labor, which at $50/hour is $100. That includes washing all of the case parts removed also.

Jack